further misdaventures in the land of Skyrim
It’s not all work, work, work. I had a little time to play Skyrim this past weekend.
I fought my third dragon in that swampy area a bit east of Whiterun, and I chased it for a while, until finally I forced it to crash-land in the foothills of the mountains.
Then the dragon’s red dot disappeared from my HUD.
That was…weird. Maybe it died in the crash? That would be convenient. Then I need only loot the dragon’s carcass and go on my way. I pick my way through the rocks, and suddenly I notice something weird.
The dragon crashed in a giant camp.
There’s a giant standing over the dragon. Specifically, the dead dragon. When it crashed, the giant clubbed it to death.
The giant is pissed.
Very suddenly I see the business end of its club descending at rapid velocity. Then I see my character tumbling head over heels, soaring hundreds of feet over the surface of Skyrim…and then gravity takes hold, and it’s time to load a saved game.
Admittedly, it’s a bit more dramatic of a death than getting eaten by a bear. Again.
-JM
lol 🙂
Giants…the other bear. Whats so funny about Skyrim (like other TES games) is the unbalance of it’s bestiary. See, you’d think that with the Dragons being the heralds of Alduin (the world devourer), they would be the most powerful, scariest, most daunting foes you’d face in the game…no. Players seem to chalk that up to everything BUT dragons, the giants, dragon priests, local wildlife (bears…rofl). Ah Bethesda, jokers at heart.
-So Jon, now that you’ve been playing Skyrim for a bit…how do you feel it stacks up to previous games in the series (i.e. Morrowind and Oblivion)? In terms of tech, of course it’s better, that is a given. I mean you personally, do you like Skyrim better than Oblivion/Morrowind? I know some diehard TES fans still think Morrowind is the best of the lot. For example: while I enjoyed the storyline in Oblivion, it was not very long, nor very in-depth, there did seem to be more in Morrowind, and alot more in Skyrim. Perhaps it’s a matter of enviroment? Oblivion’s lush southern european landscapes, or Skyrim’s frozen scandinavian like lands? Or perhaps you preferred Morrowind’s totally alien setting?
-Speaking of Morrowind, did you hear about the upcoming Skywind mod? It’s Morrowind on the Skyrim engine, the entire thing modded over, it looks pretty stunning. But I don’t know if you even go for mods?
On another unrelated note, I’d suggested to you earlier “War of the Roses”, to which you declined saying it was an mmo, to which I responded it was not and that it had single player elements. Well I’d like to make a correction now that I’ve been playing the game (it just came out on Oct 2nd):
It does have single player elements, but not the campaign games sites said it would have…just a few maps where you can practice, training battlegrounds. It is mostly a multiplayer game, death match arena kind of thing. Though it is very fun. I think calling it a mmo is a bit much (it’s no more an mmo than Call of Duty or Halo multiplayer), if your not into online battlefield gameplay (even if there is no fees attached) then you probable would not enjoy it. So I unrecommend it. 😉
“Giants…the other bear. Whats so funny about Skyrim (like other TES games) is the unbalance of it’s bestiary. See, you’d think that with the Dragons being the heralds of Alduin (the world devourer), they would be the most powerful, scariest, most daunting foes you’d face in the game…no.”
I do like that aspect of the game – it mirrors the occasional random absurdity of real life. Like General John Sedgwick proclaiming confidently the Confederate snipers could not possibly hit an elephant at this distance shortly before his demise via Confederate snipers. In the same vein, the mighty Dovakhiin, the feared Dragonborn, the slayer of the world-devourer getting eaten by some random bear.
“So Jon, now that you’ve been playing Skyrim for a bit…how do you feel it stacks up to previous games in the series (i.e. Morrowind and Oblivion)? In terms of tech, of course it’s better, that is a given. I mean you personally, do you like Skyrim better than Oblivion/Morrowind?”
Morrowind remains my favorite because Morrowind had the best setting and the best story. Morrowind reminded me a bit of Roman Judea in the 1st century AD. And I vastly enjoyed the historical and mythological verisimilitude of the story, especially the parts with the Nerevarine, the Tribunal, the Sixth House, and Dagoth Ur. Or how the mystery of the fate of the Dwemer or how exactly Lord Nerevar died is handled. But that will be its own post someday.
“n another unrelated note, I’d suggested to you earlier “War of the Roses”, to which you declined saying it was an mmo, to which I responded it was not and that it had single player elements. Well I’d like to make a correction now that I’ve been playing the game (it just came out on Oct 2nd):
It does have single player elements, but not the campaign games sites said it would have…just a few maps where you can practice, training battlegrounds. It is mostly a multiplayer game, death match arena kind of thing. Though it is very fun. I think calling it a mmo is a bit much (it’s no more an mmo than Call of Duty or Halo multiplayer), if your not into online battlefield gameplay (even if there is no fees attached) then you probable would not enjoy it. So I unrecommend it.”
I’m awaiting to hear more details about Mount & Blade 2: Bannerlord. I hope it retains the original game’s core strengths.
PART ONE
“In the same vein, the mighty Dovakhiin, the feared Dragonborn, the slayer of the world-devourer getting eaten by some random bear.”
Absurd indeed…and hilarious!
“Mount & Blade 2: Bannerlord”
What?! I didn’t even know this was in the works!
Thank you God 😀
“Morrowind remains my favorite because…”
If that is true, then would you ever consider trying out the Skywind mod? Like I said, it’s not user created, it really is Morrowind transfered over to the Skyrim engine…all the same locations, quests, peoples, etc. It really is Morrowind ala Skyrim.
“Morrowind reminded me a bit of Roman Judea in the 1st century AD.”
Oh very much so, complete with a powerful temple, foreign occupation (that looked very much like Roman legions), prophesied Messiah figure (who defeats the evil one AND brings about the end of the temple). I don’t think this was accidental either, was probably done on purpose. In other aspects, the feel was very medieval, complete with Catholic Church like religious authority (which has uses more than a few catholic practices), feudal rule, houses, and the like. Morrowind was an interesting mix of the ancient and the medieval.
I hope you do write up a post of your thoughts on Morrowind someday! But in the meantime, there are a few questions I’d like to ask you related to TES and the Morrowind setting, if you don’t mind (or if you even have the time)! (Note: these are things I would have asked you regardless of whether or not you would do a post on Morrowind someday) So I’ll split this post up, to make it easier for you to respond.
“If that is true, then would you ever consider trying out the Skywind mod?”
Absolutely I would. I’m curious how they would implement dialogue, though – Morrowind had walls of text for dialog, which is part of the reason I felt Oblivion and Skyrim have less depth. The switch to all-voice actors necessitated shorter dialog.
“Absolutely I would.”
Same here 🙂
I’m not sure what they will be doing for the dialogue, though I doubt they would give it any new voice overs (probably a good thing, seeing as how they are modders, not voice actors). This whole thing is a kind of mod/port mix, so we’ll have to wait and see!
Just remember to you’ll need the entire Morrowind series (Morrwind, Tribunal, Blood Moon), to be able to play the mod, as it requires both Skyrim and the complete Morrowind saga.
BTW, not sure if you know this, but the Hearthfire DLC was released for the PC last week (the 4th).
PART TWO
Stupid, silly question first 😉
1.Who do you think would win in a fight: the Nerevarine, Hero of Kvatch (or what ever the guy from Oblivion was called…I guess he is Sheogorath now, right? The new mad god), or the Dovakhiin?
Hey, your the fantasy writer here, you be the one to know the answer. 😉
Now the serious ones!
2.What did you think about the Tribual, their temple and what not? Good or evil, righteous or corrupt, boon or bane? I’d be interested to hear what you made of them.
I kind of miss them myself, lol. They were interesting to be sure, and I liked some of the catholic feel they gave to their temple (then again they did the same to the imperial faith, lol, gotta love the crystal dragon Jesus trope), despite some of the crazy theology behind it (Vivec…the hermaphrodite god…WHA…?!?!), and a nice chunk of it was positively eastern to boot(like the temple’s mock trinity, which I think more resembles the Hindu triad than the Christian trinity, or some tales of Vivec that seemed to be inspired by the Buddha), making it quite a strange mix. It was sad to see it go, at least I thought so. But I guess it was inevitable, they did after all usurp the gods, heh! But in their defence, the TES universe is full of gods that come and go, there is no real one true God there, the TES cosmology seems to be based off a scheme of power, have enough and your essentially a god. And with their (tribunal) having used the heart of a god, they were essentially became divine beings themselves. Plus they were good to the Dunmer, and were certainly a step up from the dunmer’s native daedra worship.
3.Did you notice how the empire changes from game to game? I mean the feel of it. It seems to bounce back and forth between having a medieval flavor to a roman one. Just look at TES three and four. In Morrowind it looked absolutely ancient Roman, from the way the legion dressed, all the way down to the way they spoke of themselves. In Oblivion they looked and felt very medieval, even the legion soldiers looked like a combination of knight and legionnaire, rather than just legionnaire. In Morrowind even their religion was played up like some classical pantheon, while in Oblivion it took on a more christian flavor (even while still being a pantheon), complete with Cathedrals, religious orders, crusaders, even down to the technical names for it’s religious leaders. Heck, even their gods looked more noble, virtuous, and good then they did in Morrowind! They even gave their followers their own version of the ten commandments, lol. In past TES games, the Empire even had their own knightly orders.
Overall it seems that the TES Imperials are part Roman, part Medieval, a kind of medieval roman empire! I like that.
It’s odd though how they change the feel of it from game to game.
1.) The Hero of Kvatch, if he became Sheogorath, because he’s the god of madness. Otherwise, the Dovakhiin, because he’s got the Voice.
2.) I think the Tribunal is a textbook example of someone doing a good thing through bad acts and consequently suffering Motive Decay ala TV Tropes. Murdering Nerevar and stealing the Heart’s power was a bad way to kick off things. Additionally, murdering Nerevar led directly to Dagoth Ur and the corprus plague. And as they got older Almalexia and Sotha Sil degenerated further into apathy and madness, especially Almalexia.
That said, the Temple seemed to be the only power in Morrowind that actively cared for the poor and sick. And Vivec did his best to try and hold things together after Dagoth Ur got going (with the Ghostfence and such). Almalexia probably would have tried to murder the Nerevarine outright, but Vivec helped him.
3.) It does seem to change from game to game. I suspect it’s whatever makes the easiest to develop. 🙂
1) Poor Nerevarine, he never stood a chance 😉
Your answer was my answer. If not for his being a god and all, the Hero of Kvatch would have lost to the Dovakhiin. But as it stands, Gods<mortals anyday!
Funny that Hero, he helps save the empire from hell itself…only to end up the new god of madness. Go figure.
2)"Murdering Nerevar and stealing the Heart’s power was a bad way to kick off things."
Hahaha, I'll say! Was this ever finalized though? I thought it was more up in the air, that the events surrounding Nerevar's death were unknown, only theories floated about. Granted it's been a long, long time since I played Morrowind (not to mention I was just a teen back then), so I don't remember every specific detail. What was the reason the Tribunal killed Nerevar? And why take the heart of Lorkhan? Did they gave ever give them an M O?
"That said, the Temple seemed to be the only power in Morrowind that actively.."
Yes, indeed they seemed like the greatest force for good in the land of Morrowind, at least since the time of Nerevar. That was my point, they weren't bad guys, they did alot of good actually (I guess that makes the whole thing have a tragic ring to it) Vivec especially, he seemed the best of the bunch. And your right he did help the Nerevarine in the end, even though he didn't have to.
Which brings me to another point, your the writer here Jon, how would you have ended things, the ultimate fate of the Tribunal members and the Nerevarine? Bethesda, as they always do, left it vague. In Oblivion you here rumors that the Nerevarine went off continent, sailing perhaps to the land of the snake men. As for Vivec, the last surviving member of the Temple, you hear rumors that he vanished, perhaps take by daedra. *SIGH* Why can't they be more specific?! It's like Bioware and their KOTOR saga, Revan journeys into unknown space, what is his fate….who knows says Bioware! Grr. Look I get why they do it, and I can like mysterious endings, but sometimes it's nice to know the ultimate fate of a character, especially one as important as the Nerevarine, or Vivec, or Revan!
So what do you think happened to the two, or perhaps how would you, the fantasy writer, have ended the Nerevarine and Vivec's story?
3)"I suspect it’s whatever makes the easiest to develop."
Heh, mybe. Personally I think it depends on the game's setting, and then they decide how to play it, more medieval or more romanesque.
“What was the reason the Tribunal killed Nerevar? And why take the heart of Lorkhan?”
I believe that Nerevar wanted to destroy the heart, but Almalexia convinced Vivec and Sotha Sil that the Heart was too great a source of power to be destroyed, that they could do too much good with it. So they teamed up, murdered Nerevar, and claimed the Heart for themselves. (At least I think that it was what happened.)
“So what do you think happened to the two, or perhaps how would you, the fantasy writer, have ended the Nerevarine and Vivec’s story?”
Actually, I like the ambiguity, and how the continuity of earlier games becomes the myth of later games. But I do like that the Nerevarine apparently spared Vivec after kill Almalexia, since that meant he forgave Vivec.
Before I say anything else, let me ask this, did you ever play the TES games before Morrowind, or were you, like me, first introduced to the series by that said game?
“that the Heart was too great a source of power to be destroyed, that they could do too much good with it.”
Ah, so the Tribunal played the Boromir role of the story! Same tragic motivation. There is only one lord of the rings…(though unlike he who wields the ring, the Tribunal actually did alot of good with their newly bestowed godhood).
Though that does bring up another question, why exactly was the heart evil? I remember that it was in the game, but not why it was so. Was it just a corruptive source? Or was the heart evil because it came from an evil god (was Lorkhan evil?)?
“becomes the myth of later games”
Actually that is pretty cool! But in these specific cases I would have liked to know a little more.
“But I do like that the Nerevarine apparently spared Vivec after kill Almalexia, since that meant he forgave Vivec.”
Yeah, I liked that too. If you think about it though, it really should have ended that way, I mean, I’ll say it again, the Tribunal and their temple were not evil, and did a ton of good for the dunmer people (not to mention helping save the whole of tamriel more than once). So Morrowind really shouldn’t have ended with the Nerevarine slaughtering the Tribunal and their temple, kind of like of Azura would have wanted it if she had more control over him. Actually I think that was an interesting development in the game, the fact that the Emperor really got his hands on Nerevarine first, rather than Azura, probably helped the Nerevarine become a force for good in Morrowind in general, rather than just a weapon of (semi)divine punishment, as Azura probably would have had him.
You know, come to think of it, why didn’t Azura favor Dagoth Ur? After all, he wanted to destroy the Tribunal temple, restore the dunmer to daedra worship (Azura), and exile the empire (who just happen to worship the aedra, and actually forbid daedra worship). You’d think she would have sided with him.
You know, that is one of the things I’m going to enjoy most about TES online, the ability to venture off into Morrowind again, and a Morrowind/Tribunal still in it’s prime (during the second era) at that!
The other day I was just reading up on TES lore (thank you internet!), and I was surprised at some of the things I missed with Skyrim. I knew that with Skyrim alot of things were thrown up in the air, the political landscape had changed drastically, for example. But what I had missed apparently was the shattering of Morrowind. Okay, okay I had heard of it, but never really took the time to ponder it until now. The Tribunal temple did not fall right after the events of Morrowind, it lasted for some time after, even the ministry of truth lasted until most of Vvarendenfell (and Morrowind) was destroyed by the Red mountain erupting again. I wonder what fate Bethesda has in store for the Dunmer in the future, now that they are exiled from their homeland?
Also, according to a wiki page, in Skyrim you can sometimes hear enemy dunmer praying to Nerevar himself! I must have missed this, did you ever hear it?